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	<title>Comments on: Feministing and Unchecked Prejudice</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/</link>
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		<title>By: Once More Unto The Breach &#124; xoros</title>
		<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/#comment-257</link>
		<dc:creator>Once More Unto The Breach &#124; xoros</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 02:24:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xoros.net/?p=292#comment-257</guid>
		<description>[...] xoros    Skip to content HomeAbout Me       &#171; Feministing and Unchecked Prejudice [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] xoros    Skip to content HomeAbout Me       &laquo; Feministing and Unchecked Prejudice [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mattie</title>
		<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/#comment-256</link>
		<dc:creator>Mattie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 16:04:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xoros.net/?p=292#comment-256</guid>
		<description>*makes sure your comment has more &quot;likes&quot; than any other, especially the reasoned and rational ones*</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>*makes sure your comment has more &#8220;likes&#8221; than any other, especially the reasoned and rational ones*</p>
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		<title>By: INGR</title>
		<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/#comment-255</link>
		<dc:creator>INGR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 16:02:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xoros.net/?p=292#comment-255</guid>
		<description>I like the combo of flounce accusation + Jesustastic &quot;I&#039;ll probably get banned for this *writes 50 more comments full of reading comprehension fail&quot; martyrdom.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like the combo of flounce accusation + Jesustastic &#8220;I&#8217;ll probably get banned for this *writes 50 more comments full of reading comprehension fail&#8221; martyrdom.</p>
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		<title>By: Mattie</title>
		<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/#comment-254</link>
		<dc:creator>Mattie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 15:56:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xoros.net/?p=292#comment-254</guid>
		<description>The whole flounce thing at the front kind of summed up the issue for me. Which was pretty much the way Feministing commenters come across as &quot;Shut the fuck up trans people while we tell you what you may be and be grateful for, and if you don&#039;t like it get lost&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The whole flounce thing at the front kind of summed up the issue for me. Which was pretty much the way Feministing commenters come across as &#8220;Shut the fuck up trans people while we tell you what you may be and be grateful for, and if you don&#8217;t like it get lost&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: INGR</title>
		<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/#comment-253</link>
		<dc:creator>INGR</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 15:46:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xoros.net/?p=292#comment-253</guid>
		<description>Reading feministing comments gives me a fucking headache. Yeah, why are you having sex with someone who is going to be perpetrating a hate crime against you! In the same vein, if only we could stop women having sex with rapists, we could really get that whole rape problem taken care of. Fuckin&#039; A, you win the logic award of the month.

I hope that discussion about the word flounce was some ultra-meta comment about the state of feminist discussion on T&#039;internets too, because otherwise I will cry into my pillow tonight.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Reading feministing comments gives me a fucking headache. Yeah, why are you having sex with someone who is going to be perpetrating a hate crime against you! In the same vein, if only we could stop women having sex with rapists, we could really get that whole rape problem taken care of. Fuckin&#8217; A, you win the logic award of the month.</p>
<p>I hope that discussion about the word flounce was some ultra-meta comment about the state of feminist discussion on T&#8217;internets too, because otherwise I will cry into my pillow tonight.</p>
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		<title>By: OH NO &#171; Oh no, Ingrid!</title>
		<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/#comment-252</link>
		<dc:creator>OH NO &#171; Oh no, Ingrid!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 15:28:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xoros.net/?p=292#comment-252</guid>
		<description>[...] Also: Mattie gives me more good reasons for not reading feminism and gendurr blogs anymore. It&#8217;s true, I don&#8217;t. I really can&#8217;t be fucked anymore because it makes my blood boil to be confronted with the same nonsensical arguments over and over and have people attempting to make me feel bad when I say I&#8217;m not there to answer their questions and fucking why don&#8217;t you just fucking wiki it. I am definitely not a credit to my whatever (o-ho!), but then we knew that already. Yes, I feel vaguely bad about not gendertalkin&#8217; anymore, but it doesn&#8217;t compare to the +4 to my happiness stat I get when not confronted with people who make me want to spoon my eyes out. Possibly related posts: (automatically generated)Champions Online going free-to-play on Halloween weekend10 Questions For Amy Poehler   &#160; [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Also: Mattie gives me more good reasons for not reading feminism and gendurr blogs anymore. It&#8217;s true, I don&#8217;t. I really can&#8217;t be fucked anymore because it makes my blood boil to be confronted with the same nonsensical arguments over and over and have people attempting to make me feel bad when I say I&#8217;m not there to answer their questions and fucking why don&#8217;t you just fucking wiki it. I am definitely not a credit to my whatever (o-ho!), but then we knew that already. Yes, I feel vaguely bad about not gendertalkin&#8217; anymore, but it doesn&#8217;t compare to the +4 to my happiness stat I get when not confronted with people who make me want to spoon my eyes out. Possibly related posts: (automatically generated)Champions Online going free-to-play on Halloween weekend10 Questions For Amy Poehler   &nbsp; [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mattie</title>
		<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/#comment-249</link>
		<dc:creator>Mattie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:48:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xoros.net/?p=292#comment-249</guid>
		<description>I feel, hope, it is most likely a mixture of the former and of trying to work out what to do. I suspect, would like to think, that they might be trying to come up with some unified statement and that, being in different places and times, they need time to get their collective act together. Such is the internet. 

I&#039;ve never got the impression that they might have sympathy, indeed until a few months ago they tended to publish more on trans issues. Now I think about it, they also tended to comment more themselves, which often acted as a balance on the more bitterly contested comment threads. I&#039;d be very dissapointed in them if it was indeed fence sitting.

I think personally I prefer to give them the benefit of the doubt for a little while longer, at least give them the chance to get to grips with what is clearly an ongoing and widespread problem for them.

Definitely a big issue is (and I say this as someone who has moderated online commmunities in the past) that if you do not moderate proactively then people will take that as permission, regardless of stated policy and regardless of what you say. You need to be seen to be &lt;i&gt;enforcing&lt;/i&gt; moderation. Ironically the more you are, then the less you need to, but it does take an investment of time and effort. Time they don&#039;t appear to have. I think they have a real problem on their hands and no easy solution in that respect. 

However, this does not excuse them. These issues have been rolling on and on, and not just with trans issues of course. It is this that makes me feel it is more a problem of policy than intent. It makes no sense to me to state they wish an inclusive community if they really do not care about intersectionality, that would just set them up to fail. 

All that said though, I feel they need to take action and they need to do it soon if it they wish to avoid the perception of actually having prejudice and issues of privilege themselves as a group, no matter how inclusive that group of editors themselves are.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I feel, hope, it is most likely a mixture of the former and of trying to work out what to do. I suspect, would like to think, that they might be trying to come up with some unified statement and that, being in different places and times, they need time to get their collective act together. Such is the internet. </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve never got the impression that they might have sympathy, indeed until a few months ago they tended to publish more on trans issues. Now I think about it, they also tended to comment more themselves, which often acted as a balance on the more bitterly contested comment threads. I&#8217;d be very dissapointed in them if it was indeed fence sitting.</p>
<p>I think personally I prefer to give them the benefit of the doubt for a little while longer, at least give them the chance to get to grips with what is clearly an ongoing and widespread problem for them.</p>
<p>Definitely a big issue is (and I say this as someone who has moderated online commmunities in the past) that if you do not moderate proactively then people will take that as permission, regardless of stated policy and regardless of what you say. You need to be seen to be <i>enforcing</i> moderation. Ironically the more you are, then the less you need to, but it does take an investment of time and effort. Time they don&#8217;t appear to have. I think they have a real problem on their hands and no easy solution in that respect. </p>
<p>However, this does not excuse them. These issues have been rolling on and on, and not just with trans issues of course. It is this that makes me feel it is more a problem of policy than intent. It makes no sense to me to state they wish an inclusive community if they really do not care about intersectionality, that would just set them up to fail. </p>
<p>All that said though, I feel they need to take action and they need to do it soon if it they wish to avoid the perception of actually having prejudice and issues of privilege themselves as a group, no matter how inclusive that group of editors themselves are.</p>
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		<title>By: timberwraith</title>
		<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/#comment-248</link>
		<dc:creator>timberwraith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 21:32:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xoros.net/?p=292#comment-248</guid>
		<description>I agree with you.  It&#039;s pretty confusing that they put those threads on moderation—assuming that&#039;s what actually happened—without an explanation. Their silent, lack-luster response makes me wonder if they are afraid of angering their transphobic readers—or even worse, I wonder if some of the Feministing team are on the fence over certain trans-related issues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with you.  It&#8217;s pretty confusing that they put those threads on moderation—assuming that&#8217;s what actually happened—without an explanation. Their silent, lack-luster response makes me wonder if they are afraid of angering their transphobic readers—or even worse, I wonder if some of the Feministing team are on the fence over certain trans-related issues.</p>
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		<title>By: Mattie</title>
		<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/#comment-247</link>
		<dc:creator>Mattie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 20:34:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xoros.net/?p=292#comment-247</guid>
		<description>It seems rather odd to put them into moderation without actually announcing that it has been done, and then saying why. I would guess that they are trying to work out what to do. Again. Equally it took them days to react, it&#039;s way, way too late. It needed intervention in the threads themselves, not promoting the next post in the series by a community member to the main page without comment or support, which is what seems to have happened with the second post you linked. Instead of giving leadership, they have done nothing that requires them to stand up and actually express an opinion. I am sure they do have one, I just don&#039;t understand why they give the appearance of ignoring these comment threads.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It seems rather odd to put them into moderation without actually announcing that it has been done, and then saying why. I would guess that they are trying to work out what to do. Again. Equally it took them days to react, it&#8217;s way, way too late. It needed intervention in the threads themselves, not promoting the next post in the series by a community member to the main page without comment or support, which is what seems to have happened with the second post you linked. Instead of giving leadership, they have done nothing that requires them to stand up and actually express an opinion. I am sure they do have one, I just don&#8217;t understand why they give the appearance of ignoring these comment threads.</p>
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		<title>By: timberwraith</title>
		<link>http://www.xoros.net/2009/11/05/feministing-and-unchecked-prejudice/#comment-246</link>
		<dc:creator>timberwraith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 06 Nov 2009 20:08:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xoros.net/?p=292#comment-246</guid>
		<description>Hi, Mattie.  Your post is right on.  Thank you.

It seems as though the comment threads have been placed under moderation for the most recent two Feministing articles dealing with trans issues (These &lt;a href=&quot;http://community.feministing.com/2009/11/being-transgender-is-dishonest.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;two&lt;/a&gt; &lt;a href=&quot;http://community.feministing.com/2009/11/having-sex-while-stealth-is-no.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;threads.&lt;/a&gt;)  The comments have died to less than a trickle and none of my new comments are posting...  Either that, or I have been banned from those threads.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi, Mattie.  Your post is right on.  Thank you.</p>
<p>It seems as though the comment threads have been placed under moderation for the most recent two Feministing articles dealing with trans issues (These <a href="http://community.feministing.com/2009/11/being-transgender-is-dishonest.html" rel="nofollow">two</a> <a href="http://community.feministing.com/2009/11/having-sex-while-stealth-is-no.html" rel="nofollow">threads.</a>)  The comments have died to less than a trickle and none of my new comments are posting&#8230;  Either that, or I have been banned from those threads.</p>
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